Rule Revisions - Your opinions
Posts: 2414
  • Posted On: Dec 18 2003 4:20pm
I like Ralen's idea.
Posts: 4025
  • Posted On: Dec 18 2003 6:31pm
I think we should also set up a system of ship repair. Don't actually tie up any shipyards for repairs, but, say that a ship repairs itself at a rate of 100 meters a day, or 500 meters a day if you insist on using a shipyard for the repairs. A 1000 meter ship with 50% hull damage needs 500 meters of her hull repaired, so she either spends five days off alone repairing herslef, or puts in at a shipyard for 1 day, OOC of course.

Ralen's idea is good, but needs some rearranging. Each group should set up a list, but keep it to themselves. If someone launches an attack, or probing assault on said system or world, group simply retrieves list, and sees what ships are where. And everyone in the said faction should see it, in the belief that there is at least one (no offense meant) honorable person in the faction who would inform someone if the deployment list was edited/altered when said other person launches assault.
Posts: 7745
  • Posted On: Dec 18 2003 7:06pm
Something about having a consequence if your public manifest is more than 2 weeks out of date.(2 weeks given because it is understandable that not everyone has lots and lots of time to devote to TRF)


We already have a rule about this; groups must keep a complete and updated manifest. If someone is blatantly in an infraction of that rule, with no good excuse, a punishment will be meted out.

I ask you revise the damage rules and make them a tad more specific and harder to bend. I bet nintey percent of OOC arguments are probably caused by people bickering over how much damage their ship can do. Perhaps the system could include actual statistics?


Hmm, like, a table that would show exactly how much damage a turbolaser does? But if we have a system showing how much damage individual weapons will do, it will turn into a calculator game, and we’ll have fights over who’s calculations are correct.

And maybe some more rules concerning disabling a ship, because it may take three posts at least to kill another ship, but it only takesone post for a hundred-meter vessel to sneak up and blast some important part of a vessel, in effect disabling it for the rest of the battle (Like at corellia).


This could have merit, possibly.

And I know it is comparativly rare that ground forces are used, but maybe some sort of rule to regulate them would be useful, especially when it comes to effectivness and training.


Heh heh, like, building ‘loyalty’ and ‘fervor’ and ‘combat skills’, traits which would apply to your NPC’s? I like this idea, very much like AoE or RoN. A new ‘yard’ that could build traits for the civilians and troops on a planet... could be interesting. This, I would like to see discussed more.

1) One set of reinforcements per battle. None of this "Oh, then I bring in another ten ISDs and blast you!"

2) Some stricter rules on reinforcements, in general. Not, "Then my ships happened to come out of hyperspace right where you were. Gee, aint we lucky?"


The first one, we’ve already dealt with. One set of reinforcements, realistic exceptions worked out beforehand with the Staff. It’s not counted as a reinforcement if its mentioned before hand in a manner such as ‘Alpha group will go in first, beta and zeta will soon follow’.

3) Make it clear that neither ramming nor self destruction, or any other manner of using your ship's destruction, is an acceptable or legal form of causing damage to enemy ships.


Yep, we’ve got this one.

4) Guidelines on the ammount of damage orbital shipyards can sustain. Perhaps hull and/or shield ratings can be assigned to them.


Good idea.

So, I guess it would go by where the fleet was jumping from, how long it would take to arrive, and the like. A well planned jump could take anywhere between several hours, to several days. Just for one jump. Within several hours, a fleet battle could potentially be over. It should also be noted that jumps often take start-stop jumps to complete, meaning that you jump from one location to another (in order to avoid going through stars, planets and asteroids), and then jump again, and sometimes over and over again to get to your destination.


We thought over the idea of gridding out a map, and saying that it’ll take so-and-so many hours to get here from here, but the idea was scrapped. Too much trouble to update the bugger, or keep a synchronized planets list. We decided to go with the common sense rule, in that a fleet will not be able to jump from one battle to the next to the next, etc.

1)What or even if a person can add to their manifest when a planet is under attack.

2) consequences of all builds that occur after a SY is damaged and in need of future repairs.

What happens to the builds if the Sy is just damaged.

Kas, you mentioned that damaged would scrap all builds that occurred after a thread.

I am not sure if this is fact as of today though.


There was a ruling on this subject a while ago. Shipyards under attack may continue to build, but a separate manifest must be kept, and the ships built may not be used in any other engagements until the fate of the yard has been determined. If the yard is destroyed, the ships in the separate manifest are scrapped.

A fleeters damage posting responsibility.

1) Does a poster responding to damage from a previous posted attack have to assign themselves damage for making a particular attack manuver to counter said manuver?

Everyone has been guilty of this and argued about it OOC at one point or another.


So, in effect, the method by which damage is meted out. I think the current manner would be, I do my post and post damage for your ships, if you have a problem we work it out in the OOC forum. I’m unsure if this is the best way to go, however, as it doesn’t give much room for the attacker to react - discuss...

I think Gue proposed the idea not too long ago, but "Fleet RPing Mods" would be most helpful. They could be few, but strictly devoted to ruling on the fleeting issues. This will reduce the number of new fleeting rules greatly, I think.


This is the Staff’s job. It wouldn’t reduce the number of rules, such a council would only enforce the rules, not make them up as they please.

I would like to see a rule that states that every single faction must have a forum with the listings of their fleet locations, moor points, and build ups, that only the staff has access to see.

That way there is the opportunity for more small scale battles, and people cannot simply go "Oh well what do you know? A huge fleet is waiting for your small force".


The problem of a huge fleet waiting can be overcome with a little scheming and plotting, the reinforcement rules will also greatly aid this. And Ceros does have a point, there would be a lot of complaining about the Staff cheating...

I think we should also set up a system of ship repair. Don't actually tie up any shipyards for repairs, but, say that a ship repairs itself at a rate of 100 meters a day, or 500 meters a day if you insist on using a shipyard for the repairs. A 1000 meter ship with 50% hull damage needs 500 meters of her hull repaired, so she either spends five days off alone repairing herslef, or puts in at a shipyard for 1 day, OOC of course.


Gue brought this up a while ago, and the idea kind of stalled. Right now there are no repair times. In the past the Staff has issued time for some ships, but currently nothing is happening.

I most definitely want KISS -- keep it simple stupid. A rule concerning how ships need to be repaired in a shipyard after a battle would be better than creating new yards.
Posts: 2915
  • Posted On: Dec 18 2003 7:53pm
My previous repair idea was that a new system of Repair yards be made, with their own build times and a system to repair ships as well...

I say we give a listing, say:

Minor Damage
Major Damage
Crippled
Disabled

Then assign modifier for each status:

Minor Damage - .1
Major Damage - .3
Disabled - .5
Crippled - .7

These modifiers represt the portion of the ships build time it must spend in a repair yard in order to reach full status again.

Ex: A Star Destroyer just escapes a major fleet engagement with Major Damamge. Now, a new Star Destroyer takes 16 days to build, but since what weve got here is a finished Star Destroyer but damaged so extensively parts of it require rebuilding and replacement. This is represented with a 5 day repair yard time (1600*.3 -rounded up-) to fix whats been wronged with the ship.
Posts: 7745
  • Posted On: Dec 18 2003 8:01pm
The naming would be better, IMO, with Minor, Medium, Major, Crippled respectively. May not be realistic IC, but it works better OOC.
Posts: 228
  • Posted On: Dec 18 2003 10:51pm
But if we have a system showing how much damage individual weapons will do, it will turn into a calculator game, and we’ll have fights over who’s calculations are correct.


It's much easier to correct math than interpret nonexistent rules. And with the first we'd be left with a single, indisputable ruling in most cases; one not a product of the Staff's variable standards of judgment (with no fault to it).

Math and roleplaying may be considered a bad mix, but, as a competitive game without many rules, fleeting is no more than a test to see which side can fill its writing with the most bullshit before making its efforts obvious.
Posts: 1381
  • Posted On: Dec 19 2003 3:12am
And a lot less fun, too.
Posts: 228
  • Posted On: Dec 19 2003 5:15am
Well, perhaps for the Grand Master of Bullshit. I find it hard to believe that the OOC arguments that complement the method are the "laughs and giggles" for everyone else that they are for you.

Also keep in mind that, for certain reasons, the above "bullshit threshold" can vary between factions and roleplayers, whether or not the degree is arguable.


With damage counts predictable by both sides given the circumstances, sound strategy would become all the more important, anyway.
Posts: 4195
  • Posted On: Dec 19 2003 6:50am

It's much easier to correct math than interpret nonexistent rules.



With what formulation?
Posts: 4025
  • Posted On: Dec 19 2003 6:53am
Grand Master of BS


*Bows to Ceros* *Bows to all members of ORS while he is at it*

Calculator damage. That takes so much out of Fleet RPing, that you may not call it Fleet RPing at all anymore. This is very comparable to ramming.

Hey, I've got a bigger ship than you. I win automatically because I have a calculator.

I say, the only way we use a calculator is if there is a hot dispute in damages, then a staff member comes in, with a chart, and calculates the best damage.